Look at yourselves critically, and you may just end up being far better at what you do. Every year, between 300 and 400 physicians take their own livesroughly one a day (Noonan, 2008). That scale is BS. The type of nursing education you have received and the experience you have earned matter a lot when you are looking for a job (although your specific nursing school might not matter that much). I have an idyllic memory. What did you major in? Usually those with the most passion, highest grades, most contributions in their lives up to that point etc. Fraternal organizations, such as CIA are a private joke among us. And this is not just my differential diagnosis i think we can go ahead and confirm that. That is not the case. The argument is this: I would be a much better doctor if I invested myself in my patients emotionally. There are other studies whose results differ in terms of IQ values or ranges. WebWhy do nurses do more than doctors? maybe? As for the poor doctors plight with student loans, too bad. Having experienced a medical education and an engineering education, I must admit that the engineering curriculum was more challenging in many respects because of the degree of abstract reasoning and logic required, which actually gave me an advantage in medical school because my problem-solvimg abilities were great for unraveling difficult clinical cases (e.g. Hint: If youre evaluating a prospective physician, investigate his timeliness beforehand. Furthermore, doctors are more commonly sued for not looking than not knowing. It would be an insult to a Physicist. There are plenty of highly intelligent people who get poor grades because they dont care to put in the effort. Look at your average national requirement for any other profession and they will almost always fall short of the requirements to get into medical school, why? I decided to go with another doctor. Nurse practitioners, at their core, are healers. Lets not even talk about comparing the IQ of a doctor to a Physicist! 4. As a current medical student, I would say the trend of practice is changing, in terms of emphasizing more patient interactions in our practices today. A good plumbers work lasts a lifetime. A good professor once told me,if you listen to the patient long enough The #1 habit to succeed in nursing school, The #1 habit to succeed in medical and nursing school, How to find & use NCLEX practice questions, What to expect from Next Generation NCLEX, How to study in nursing school (and pass with flying colors). I agree. Sounds like most of you who think doctors are dumb have had some pretty negative experiences. If your doctors chronic lateness makes you grind your teeth, why stay with him? Sure, incompetence is incompetence, but people are people as well, and well theyre treated goes a long way. Pre-appointment labs. IQ tests dont have the same predictive validity as the tests stated above. Just like in other medical professions, many nurses have specializations and a variety of skill sets. Last week I interviewed a doctor who told me that his primary care doc is a physician assistant who has been trained to deliver primary care. (Risk of not having the intended outcome, risk of having a worse ourcome.) To participate in the modern American medical system, you actually have to be a bit of a drone. An emergency clinic visit and root canal later, he told his dentist she was fired. Over the course of my life, I have been to doctors that otherwise seem to have graduated from good med-schools. Not everyone sits in a garage telling the mechanic how to fix a car, but everone has an opinion about Heath care. I have seen people get into med school with even C averages. The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reported that the 2020 median salary for a licensed practical nurse (LPN) was $48,820 per year, or $23.47 per hour. Indeed, one shouldnt think doctors as either bad or good. I interact with different people from different jobs everyday. combat,,,,there is is a huge difference in the field and the trauma bay in a hospital setting,,,,these Docs are great at what they do,,,but they dont see the type of trauma we do,,,,neither do the trauma Docs,,,they just dont,,,,I have moved a couple of them aside to tx a pt,,,not because of their incompetency,,,,but just their lack of experience in these situations,,,,more special operations medicine needs to be integrated into the civilian world,,,,we do things that save lives,,,quickly, and without thought,,,its instinct,,,,MDs are extremely bright, intelligent people,,,,but in severe trauma cases,,there needs to be more outside the box thinking!! In fact, subserviently following a doctors orders could get a nurse in trouble. In short, if we examined a group of intelligent people, the smartest-sounding people in the group could just be the worst at hiding it. Sh. Jan 15, 2012 #29 Bl4ckout said: Plus doctors are smarter! My neurosurgeon would agree with Bris Vegas. you nailed it thank you. Because of the reasons mentioned above and not a huge number of available spots. Based on the stats, doctors are not necessarily smarter than many of their patients, just have more book knowledge. While most of the physicians who have replied on this website are from the US, I am from Australia. In-state tuition for medical school is not onerous for most states. None of those schools have class sizes of 200. The General Medical Councils state of medical education and practice report, published earlier this month, showed a vicious cycle of doctors leaving because 1 For registered nurses, the BLS reports a 2020 median annual salary of $75,330. Just like in other [By the way, if you are studying for the NCLEX exam? The few schools with class sizes over 200 recieve applicants in the 10,000s. Its all about ability. First of all, is IQ even a valid way of measuring intelligence? Some people are so darn stupid. Nurses Are So Great Because They Are Trained While their education may not be as thorough or intensive as that of a doctor, nurses frequently hold More than ever, we need doctors who are competent at both the lab bench and the hospital bedside. Thanks again. As a consequence who gets into medicine? There is quite a range of intelligence among Doctors. WebThe trade-off to having additional responsibility and educational requirements as an NP comes through when comparing earning potential. While I know numerous nurses who are much smarter than the average physician, there are many nurses who think theyre smarter than the doctors. Getting good grades in school has more to do with ambition and drive than intelligence. basic engineer knows alittle about everything, same with general MD. I understand its fun sometimes to poke fun at certain professions, and stereotypes such as the nerdy engineer, the sloppy physician that never sees daylight, and the evil lawyer that sold his/her soul to enter law school, but if you actually reflect and critically think, I think you will come to a slightly different conclusion. Obviously, they need to be of above average intelligence to get into medical school but there are other factors involved. One of the clearest signs you should move on is if he walks out of the room while youre still talking, says Clancy. Thats what happened when her sister met with a surgeon to determine if her daughter should go through with a procedure. Watch popular content from the following creators: Johnathan Dodson(@thejohnathandodson), ContentHouseTikTok(@contenthousetiktok), julia(@michaelceraprincess), Dr. Jermaine & Jeremy(@twin.doctors.j), Kunal Sood M.D. Its sad that as a physician, if we want to keep our practices open, this game is something we have to play. The years I have spent with my wife have shown me the true colors of many nurses who have their cliques. Nurses have better work schedules. I guarantee, if a new study was conducted, the IQ scores for MDs would be lower than stated above. Lol. Your nurse is just as intelligent and just as competent as your physician. At no point should it include references (as these are used to strengthen and support your argument in the body of the text). That is, after all, the entire point of medicine. Just like you cant compare a engineer and a lawyer. You are preaching poor writing technique and use of language among doctors, yet fall well short yourself. The encounter is supposed to embody a therapeutic alliance, one in which a SHARED decision is made. @Amy. Just like the best tradesmen are busy and the best lawyers are expensive. Even if you like your doctor, a bad office staff could signal its time to look elsewhere. Medical schools have acknowledged these problems and have begun pushing for more arts and humanities in medicine. (Do they have hospital privileges?there are some who choose not to that are still smart though. The 10 Mistakes Every Patient Makes, recalls the time her husband developed severe tooth pain on a weekend. After three rounds, I concluded that we werent going to get to a productive place, and I didnt go back.. The specific skill tests on traditional IQ tests should correlate very well with skills needed to do surgery and other more creative specialties, whereas the ability to focus and hold onto details represented by good grades would correlate well with more algorithmic specialties like primary care or oncology. world's best flashcard app? The back channel gets immediate results, the chain of comand gets boged down in ritual. Sure, they have the basics down, but there is so much more they are not aware of such as the use of colons, semi-colons, and other technical devices, punctuations, etc. When Christopher J. D. Wallis In fact, only about 12% of all nurses are male, according to the United States Department of Labor. http://www.statisticbrain.com/iq-estimates-by-intended-college-major/). The medical profession heavily selects for certain personality traits, especially those that allow a physician to work well with the general population (empathy, relateability, humilty, etc.). You dont mesh. If hes slacking, an important piece of your care could slip through the cracks. This meant even more school debt because medical school doesnt equip doctors with the skills and knowledge of scientists. But that number has been steadily increasing. Because there is a large competition for it, why? This isnt true. The nurses primary objective is to to facilitate the care of the patient, and assist the doctor. The fact that you felt the need to post your IQ as some badge of honor while attempting to undermine the very premise of this article says it all. Anyone whos name is FUCKPATADAMSwell thats all you need to see to determined where or not you should take what they say seriously. I made the same mistake guessing that MDs had science degrees. Both are needed. Only for the intellectually honest among us. In short, there are many, many more basic science phDs awarded each year than the number of people born each year with a 160+ IQ. Social skills are also important to most specialties with some notable exceptions. the truth !! This is a very poor assumption on your part. Trust me! Nurses are also generally in charge of patient advocacy and education, which means that it is usually a nurse, not a doctor, that will make sure you know how to care for yourself after leaving the hospital or medical center. Namaste. Are nurses smarter than resident physicians? People are dumb. For in-patient nurses, or roughly 2 million of the 4.2 million nurses working in the US, that number is closer to 50%, according to The American Association of Laurie, that is most unfortunate. I do know a little about what is going on with me. Otherwise, they would not have gotten in and graduates in the first place. I happen to be an MD/PhD with undergraduate training in engineering, and subjectively, I found many of my engineering classmates to be brighter and better problem-solvers and abstract thinkers than my medical school classmates, the majority of whom had life-science backgrounds. Dont be afraid to say I do not know. @ Dr. Castle I think you summed it up nicely. But I get frustrated by those same patients. []. Yes, as surprising as it may sound, this is true. We are increasing our IQ statistics but consistently neglecting our EQ measurements. document.getElementById( "ak_js" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Im a Canadian internal medicine doctor. (Solved & Explained) WorkVeteran.com Nursing School Harder than Medical School? I recently conducted research in the area and found that doctors have the highest rate of suicide of any profession. NewEastCoastRN said: There is a theme echoed throughout these discussions that I think should really be Medical students in these countries are typically solid but unremarkable high school graduates (top 1/3 of students). Nearly killed by COVID-19, Michigan doctors, nurses return humbled, smarter. Im a Physician and here is my impression of the general intelligence of Physicians. The only reason that medical school is hard to get into in Western countries is the high pay and prestige. For example, and on a technical communication standpoint, I have noticed that most students, even those with the superiority complex do not know how to write well. If you are, we have a ton of great articles to help you learn efficiently and make the most out of nursing school. @bris I dont know the stats on engineering Ph.D. iQs but as a profession doctors average rank higher on IQ than all engineering fields. To get into a PhD programme you need a 4 year Honours (equivalent to a US Masters) degree with a High Distinction (A+) average. He doesnt coordinate with other doctors. You dont feel comfortable with him, or wonder about his competence. Often, systemic issues and the way clinicians are trained can lead to perceived gaslighting. Medical scientists know more about how the human body works. Plus doctors are smarter! Look it up, This is so true Im a nurse and deal with this. An interesting study published by the University of Wisconsin suggests that doctors (M.D or equiv O.D, dents, etc) have the highest IQ on average. If you kiss peoples asses an make them fill good an you know people than it is not a problem to get a exceptionally good recommendation! They just find u dull and uninitiated. To a doctor, they have gone through so much grueling training and rigorous education that most havent, so they feel like they work harder and everyone else is stupid. Nurses are key to quality medical care. I dont know where you inferred that I said being nice is more important than competency of care. That being said, I do know one genius dr (who is exactly a genius because he was tested) but he transitioned into research because he was bullied by the other doctors. Yes the best physicians are the ones who connect well with patientsand they are difficult to get in to see. On the other hand, having access to that trust means that it is more likely the patient will follow the doctors advice and so chances for a quick recovery are significantly higher. Doctor's don't know anything, patients don't know anything, administrators don't Here are nine signs that its time to fire your doctor. There are the nurses who eat their young. So let's not underestimate their abilities! I got a secret 4 you. WebThe trade-off to having additional responsibility and educational requirements as an NP comes through when comparing earning potential. Later on down the road it turns out this patient has a full blown serious illness, and the doctor didnt catch it because he didnt want to hear the patient out. Eighty-hour weeks are usually reserved for self-employed types. I so agree! His dentists voicemail included a cell phone number and a promise of a quick response, but he never heard back. A often neglected, but perhaps more important measurement is Emotional intelligence. Its those who forget the world beyond their particular niches who end up being terrible doctors, be that the rest of medicine, or the social and psychological contexts their patients bring to the table. If youre the type of person who feels they must post their IQ on line, and trumpets how they fire narcissistic doctors, and how they are the CEO but not just the CEO, the CEO and President did you ever think that maybe your trouble with doctors has possibly come from your attempts to transfer the authority you have over others at your company into a sphere in which your authority is actually limited to yourself? dude please Not all doctors are intelligent and smart Especially in present era Where half the institutions are private In a private college You pay the donation, pay the fee And Even without attending a single lecture you get your degree certificate after 6 yrs.. and If you dont wanna slog during exams, theres a bypass. Out. I am honestly worried about stopping at a roadside incident with all theres a wide spectrum just like in engineering. Im much too correct. I write about topics related to a career in medicine. Personally I think that doctors are better actors than scientists. Nursing isnt a homogeneous field. Many nurses even complete advanced education, furthering their degrees through graduate and post-graduate work. I work for a College of Medicine at a University in the U.S. and interact with M.D./PhD medical faculty, staff, and students. Try comparing your super-duper smart doctors to these physicists. However, I am saying that doctors with empathy and human compassion are much better than just doctors with their book smarts. i know students who have done the voulenteer hours but with no REAL self-enhancing benefits because they just went but did not particpate with there heart. For in-patient nurses, or roughly 2 million of the 4.2 million nurses working in the US, that number is closer to 50%, according to The American Association of Colleges of Nurses. You and your doctor dont need to see eye to eye on everything, but its helpful if you work well together. Doctors treat patients, not diseases. If your doctor doesnt take the time to answer your questions or address your concerns, theres a problem. If they blow you offor neglect to give your message to the physician, say about side effects of a new medicationyour health could be at risk. Unless med school is longer than 4 years..which would put the student in more debt, and would probably be yet another deterrent for enrolling in med school. #5. everyone, leave doctors alone, they put in the hard work to get to where they are and because of that they deserve it, start complaining after you spend 15+ years getting educated to save people lives, i do still agree about the superiority complex tho. These specialists, of course, dont wait on customers. Many rural hospitals dont have anesthesiologists available, and would not be able to provide surgical and anesthesia In fact, the perception of nursing as a womens job is a real problem in the nursing field. Of course with all the hassle and crap doctors have to deal with now, and much lower pay these days, med students are overall a less gifted group now than they were in the 70s, An IQ of 135 would put you at the TOP of the medical profession. Hes unreachable. He doesnt listen. Mine is 164 so Im not fooled by quacks. See, I got a secret for u. Sure many people can study and learn as much as a docbut just by being raised around doctors? Now some Doctors are smart enough to see that this is not the best way to practice medicine but others are brainwashed. Veterans rated VA hospitals higher than private facilities for things like patient satisfaction, hospital cleanliness and communication with nurses and doctors. Recent studies have shown that IQ tests are not good at capturing a persons intelligence. your specific nursing school might not matter, How to study for the NCLEX more efficiently, The best way to use NCLEX practice questions. They have to go through years of education, take exams like the NCLEX, and spend countless of hours in the hospital to learn how to best help people. The average intellect in medicine is detrimental because they dont know the reasons for the medications they are prescribing and at what dosages, leading to crises such as the opioid epidemic, or dark triad personalities enter the profession just to make extra cash off patients or be in the perfect position t rape or exploit transference symptoms. That laptop is where they search and get their information from. A good doctor is available for follow-up questions and concerns. Lmao. Moreover, there would be less doctors to help the increasing idiot Americans who do harm to their bodies that can easily be prevented. It makes life very difficult to those Maybe this will help you in the future so you dont have to fire all those pesky doctors who wont bow down and obey the genius level CEO (and President, dont forget President)geez! If a doctor doesnt explain himself, or at least not to your satisfaction, at that point a doctor is bad, Lin says. But for real intelligence, Id largely look to other fields. The study referenced in this article was old and had a huge loophole for sample bias too. Im an engineer who has found himself working among doctors. You cannot compare a doctor and an engineer. 1. Medicine is simply considered to be an ordinary middle class job like teaching or engineering. A THEORETICAL PERSPECTIVE ON THE REASONS WHY & POLICY RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW TO REGULATE OCCURRENCES. Suppose someone comes in with the beginnings of a serious illness, but this persons doctor decides to ignore what the patient says because it disinterests him or because he thinks he knows better about the patients own body.
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